Canine Autoimmune Hemolytic Anemia (AIHA & IMHA) - Would liver help production of red blood cells

All Azi collapsed on Christmas night luckly we got her to an emergency vet who stablised her. We were in holiday for Christmas with Family and she had been ill for a couple of days. As it was the holiday period the small vets that was close to where we were staying couldnt get blood work done. On boxing day we got her into a large Animal hospital in Aberdeen. Her first PCV they took they didnt believe as it registered 6. The next was up to 10 and she was given a blood transfusion. She is now up to 24 so i am keeping my fingers crossed. She is eating the Chicken and rice dog recovery food from Royal Canin. Some good advice i got from one of the vets was to give her small meals frequently. I have got her up from 1/4 of a can every four hours to 1/2 a can. As AIHA is attacking the red blood cells should i be look at getting her to eat things high in Iron such as the liver? Regards Ian

Ian Uk

Ian, the fact that Azi is eating at all right now is a very good thing. Frequent meals sounds like a good idea for the time being. Liver is a good choice but only in small amounts. It's very rich and will likely cause diarrhea. Lots of us on here feed our dogs a liver cleansing diet because the drugs are very hard on the body and liver. Is Azi taking any stomach protectants? Here's a good site to look at for a diet.... http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/liver_diet.htm I'ld also very strongly recommend for you to check out Joannes Meisha's Hope website. This site has helped countless people in their struggle with this disease. Here's a link to it... http://www.cloudnet.com/~jdickson/treatment.htm What is Azi taking for drugs? Is the vet familiar with AIHA? This is very important. If you have any questions ask away. We're here to help in any way we can and there are loads of people here with a wealth of knowledge. I'll keep Azi in my thoughts and prayers. Johnny & Tessy

Johnny

Johnny Thanks very much for your prompt response. I have read Joannes Meisha's website and have felt a lot better since then. The vet where she was diagnosed is very large and well equipped and they were very up to date with AIHA and how to treat it. We have now come back home to Cheltenham and the vet here to does seem to be very informed. He did say that only 30% of dogs normally survive the intial stages, which was a bit worrying. She is on 1/4 x 75mg Asprin tablet once a day for her blood clotting 1 x 20mg Famotidine one a day for her anti-acid 2 x 25mg Prednisolone twice a day (her weight is 25kg) 1 x 250mg Noroclav twice daily She seems to be responding. Though very lethargic. Thankfully my boss is understanding so i can spend at least the next 10 days at home. Regards Ian & Azi

Ian Cheltenham

Ian, There is no doubt that this is a very serious disease. You will learn a lot over the next few weeks about it and become your dogs advocate. But please don't let anybody discourage you with percentages of dogs that will not make it! there are lots of people on this board who have dogs that DID make it. Stay positive, read the success stories on Joannes website and learn all you can. What breed/mix is Azi and how old is she? Btw. there is a very good drug called Azathoprene, many of us call it Azi, that can be added. It is a very effective immune suppressant. maybe mention it to your vet? Best wishes, Brigitte & Kahlu

Brigitte BC Canada

Ian, i just realized that your initial question for iron supplementation has not yet been answered. You can certainly feed liver, but only in very small doses. Patrice posted at one point the exact weight liver amount ratio. Good supplements for blood building would be vitamin B12 and folic acid. I gave Kahlu (60lbs.) 250mg B12, 100mg iron and 5mg folic acid. Best wishes, Brigitte & Kahlu

Brigitte BC Canada

So sorry your Azi is not feeling very well. Stay strong, get knowledgeable and fight tooth and nail. I say this to everyone who is new to this, so I can sound a bit redundant, but hang in there. You have to obtain all the info you can and make sure your vet is up to par with AIHA info. Not all of them are as it's a relatively obscure disease. Good luck and keep us posted. We are here for you through thick and thin.

Mardi Northern Calif

Dear Ian Like Mardi and everyone else here, I wish you well with Azi - stay strong and positive - Im trying to though Im only three months in with Riley. A heap of good advice here which Im always asking for. Thats a fantastic jump for the PCV from 6 to 24, Azi sounds like a fighter. Small meals often is a good thing, particularly to help the tummy with all the medication they have to have. Pancreatitis can be an issue, so low fat is the go. Others will help you with the liver question. My understanding is that this illness is not about iron levels, though a good guide would be to get a full blood count including the biochemistry levels so you know whats going on with Azi. I tried to give my Riley liver and it kind of made ME ill preparing it. As well as the Meisha's hope site, I found it very useful to go through the archives on this site as you then find the initial stories of those whose dogs are surviving, and they are the ones offering you support today. Good luck Ian, and lets know how are you going. Tell us what type of dog Azi is. Silka

Silka Melbourne Australia

Liver is an excellent source of many vitamins and minerals. I was surprised one day to read how much B-12 is in liver, let alone being a great source for iron and folic acid! It is, however, a very rich food. A little goes a long way. Limit the amount to approximately *1 ounce per 10 pounds of dog per day* to avoid diarrhea. You can cook it or give it raw. Some dogs will not eat raw, others love it. Cassie does not like it raw, Chance loves it raw! It is a misnomer that all anemia is caused by iron poor blood. That is not always true. Anemia is a symptom of some condition, not a disease in and of itself. Finding the cause and treating that will resolve the symptom of anemia. Most dogs owners that are on this forum are battling autoimmune destruction as a cause of anemia, but it is not rare to find dogs that also have a nutritional deficiency that is also contributing. It is very true that the bone marrow must have enough iron, B-12 and folic acid to make red blood cells. If any of these are low in the body, there will be a maturation deficit and the red blood cells will not be formed well, they will be odd sized and fragile, possibly not having enough iron inside to carry O2 properly. The dog's liver stores these particular nutrients in a fairly large quantity and it is not until these stores are depleted that it becomes apparent that there is some kind of nutritional deficiency. In these cases, iron and B-12 may need to be administered via shots. What further complicates this is that many dogs being treated for AIHA are taking so many drugs that they have a tendency to have diarrhea or other digestive disorders. This can lead to malabsorption issues which contribute to malnutrition. What is important is to feed highly digestible food that has high quality protein, moderate fat and low to none carbohydrates (esp grains and corn which dogs are unable to digest well). Supplements are great and they needn't be expensive or fancy to provide what a dog needs. I use human grade supplements from companies that have a good reputation for quality. The minimum would be some kind of B-50, Vit C, Vit E and fish oil. If a dog has malabsorption issues, B-12, folic acid (and possibly iron) may not make it into the body via digestion. These levels can be tested in the blood and if low can be administered with a syringe easily at home. You can make your own dog food, but be prepared to do a bit of studying to make sure that it is properly balanced (ratio of phosphorus to calcium is important). Some companies have moved to making high quality kibble that is grain-less and there are a growing number of dog food makers who provide a home-like cooked food, or raw diets. If the dog's liver enzymes from the chemical screen test show higher than normal numbers, going to the Dodd's liver cleansing diet may be appropriate during treatment. Some dogs, however, cannot tolerate the lower levels of some nutrients in this diet and need a more balanced diet. Short term it should be a fine diet. my best patrice

Patrice NYS

Hmmm, that is: 1 ounce per 10 pounds of dog PER WEEK, NOT PER DAY! Whoops, my error. So a 90 pound dog could get approximately one pound of liver per week and do quite well with it. So a 2 inch square per day would be just about right. Sorry patrice

Patrice NYS

Thank you all for your comments, they have been very helpful. Going to try Azi with a small ammount of liver today and see how she gets on. Azi PCV was up to 30 today, so the vet has taken her off the antibiotics, asprin and anti-acids to lessen the chances of a stomach ulcer. She has been scanned twice with no sign of any cancer's so hers hoping that it was just triggered off by some infection.

Ian Cheltenham

Ian, Glad to read that Azi's PCV is on the rise. It usually goes up after a transfusion. I think if it was my dog I would keep her on the anti-acids as long as she is on the Pred. The steroids are really hard on them so a little protection would not be a bad thing. Keep us posted.

Penny Lytle Creek Calif

Hello Ian, Cocos vet had her on pred without any stomach protectant and she started having blood in her stool within a week or so. Her vet I have her going to now told me her intestinal track is inflamed and put her on two different stomach protectants. So I would definitely ask your vet to put her on something. Coco is on ranitidine and carafate. Good luck with Azis recovery....Kelly

kelly Redding

This thread was discussed between 30/12/2009 and 02/01/2010

Canine Autoimmune Hemolytic Anemia (AIHA & IMHA) forum index

This thread is from the Vetnet archive. The live Vetnet forum is active now.